Opening a Gateway to the Internet:
An Interview with Will Bunker
Copyright (c) 1994, L. Shawn Aiken
All rights reserved



        Imagine a world brimming over with data.  Data you need - whether it
be for business or pleasure.  And imagine everybody in that world, screaming
at the tops of their lungs, in a language you don't understand.  That's the
Internet.  And even if you have the money and the time to deal with it, it is
still an awful mess.
        On October 6, 1994, I interviewed Will Bunker, a pioneer in the field
of bringing the Internet in a cheap and user friendly package to your
electronic doorstep.  Mr. Bunker is the Sysop of the International On-line
Service, located in Dallas, Texas, and has done more in life than just stare
at a computer, getting screen burn on his retinas.
            

STTS: What kinds of experience and training do you have on computers?

Mr. Bunker: I started playing around with them in college.  My major was 
Industrial Engineering and we had a few projects.  When I moved to Dallas, I 
picked up a Computer Currents and was fascinated by BBSes.  Then I spent a 
year and a half in exile in Russia working.  There I ran across GLASNET 
(Russian Internet) and learned more about the medium.  On my vacation I 
starting reading "Boardwatch" and began to put together a business plan - and 
the International On-line Service is the result of that.  We started in 
January and after many rabbit trails we have arrived today with an Internet 
service that I hope people can enjoy.

STTS: Where are you originally from?

Mr. Bunker: A small town called Lake Village, Arkansas.  It is on the border 
wit Mississippi where I went to high school and college.

STTS: So how did you get to Dallas, and when?

Mr. Bunker: I interviewed with my company in 1992 and moved here in the 
summer of '92.

STTS: And which company was that?

Mr. Bunker: Well, it is a small group of private companies owned by N.B. 
Hunt.  The first one that I worked with was a natural resources outfit (Hunt 
Exploration and Mining Company) and that is how I ended up in Russia.

STTS: Natural Resources?  Oil and gas, perhaps?

Mr. Bunker: Mostly oil and a gas, but we all so looked at a few mineral 
projects in some of the Republics over there.

STTS: Where were you 'stationed'?

Mr. Bunker: I lived in Moscow, but spent about 25% of my time on the road 
visiting various places and running the numbers on the projects that we 
looked at.  None of which were that attractive considering the vast risks 
involved.

STTS: Do you learn to speak Russian, or did the Russians speak English?

Mr. Bunker: I learned conversational Russian while I was there but I it is 
fading fast.  I had a really good interpreter that went everywhere with me 
to keep me out of trouble, but towards the end I started actually having 
conversations with people and it was pretty neat.  The only thing that I 
regret about leaving is not finishing learning how to speak.  Oh well, since 
it is so rough there I probably won't need it again anyway.

STTS: What places did you visit?

Mr. Bunker: I saw quite a few. Arkangel in the north.  Kyrgyistan, Kazakstan, 
Azerbejan, Uzbekistan in the south.  Chelyabinsk, and Magnitagorsk in the 
Urals.  Siberia, even Kamchatka and Vladivistok.  I didn't spend any time in 
the middle portion or in Ukraine or Bylorussia.

STTS: Quite a few of those places are in civil war.  Did you have to dodge 
any bullets?

Mr. Bunker: I was there during the coup attempt but my apartment was not 
around the Parliament building, although I could hear the tanks firing.  More 
of a threat was the organized crime although I was fortunate that they never 
zeroed in on me.

STTS: What exactly was you job there?

Mr. Bunker: I guess you could call me the Project Manager.  I was in charge 
of the Russians in the sense that I had to make sure that their numbers 
matched Western economics.

STTS: As opposed to 'Eastern economics'?

Mr. Bunker: Yes, they considered a project with payout where you get all the 
money back eventually.  With no interest.  So you really had to be careful 
not to take the feasibility studies too seriously.

STTS: All those years of communism I guess.  They had no business skills?

Mr. Bunker: They had plenty of business skills, just not in the same way that 
we think of.  They could overcome tremendous obstacles that their environment 
(social, political, etc. ) placed in their way.  Yet that would not translate 
to me asking money in a way that would benefit a traditional business in our 
sense.

STTS: Was it a matter of corruption, or just socialist ideas of production, 
rather than a 'for profit' motive?

Mr. Bunker: All of the above.  They probably were closer to being a mafia 
state than a true communistic state.  The KGB is not really much different 
than organized crime.  Nor has it really changed now.  It is just a little 
more chaotic.  Those that have power receive all of the benefits leaving 
very little for anyone else.  At least that is how it appears to some looking 
in from the outside.

STTS: Was it hard to accomplish your objectives?

Mr. Bunker: Extremely.  They just don't have the infrastructure that we take 
for granted.  Telephones, business equipment, airports, hotels, roads, cars, 
banking, law, etc.  You name it and they don't have it.

STTS: Was the Russian Internet up to western standards?

Mr. Bunker: Glasnet is pretty cool.  It is basically a USENET feed that comes 
off of a satellite.  They have 3 phone lines and you must go to their office 
and give them roubles in advance to set up an account.  It allowed me to 
receive news much faster that most people unless they had CNN of course.  It 
was quite interesting to see the Internet work so well in a place so remote.

STTS: What kind of hardware did it use?  Did it have a good storage ability?

Mr. Bunker: I think it was a group of 486's and seemed to keep messages about 
2 weeks which was enough for me.  It sounds so primitive here, but there it 
was really awesome.  I remember many a winter night rummaging through 
newsgroups learning a about different things.

STTS: When did you first get into BBSing?

Mr. Bunker: The summer of 92 before I left Dallas, I began to call BBSes 
that were listed in the back of "Computer Currents".  I pretty much dropped 
it until I found Glasnet in Fall of 93.  Then I really got involved in 
January of this year as I started to put this thing together.

STTS: How did this IOS thing come about?  Where did the idea come from?  How 
did you get it together?

Mr. Bunker: The idea came from "Boardwatch", which I picked up in April of 
'93.  I thought a lot about it as I traveled around in Russia.  I talked my 
boss into giving it shot in December of '93.  Then we started doing the 
feasibility in January of this year.

STTS: And who is your boss?  Is this company affiliated? 

Mr. Bunker: Yes IOS is a part of the N.B.  Hunt group.  I pretty much run the 
thing, but with all of the expenses I couldn't fund it myself.  So, I work 
for IOS and set the pace on trying to make a go of it.

STTS: And what is the philosophy behind IOS?

Mr. Bunker: Well, right now we are trying to put together an interface for 
the Internet that will allow the average person to jump on, find their area 
of interest, access the information, and jump off.

STTS: There are several systems that give access to the Internet.  How is IOS
different?

Mr. Bunker: Our interface uses RIP and ANSI screens.  This means that someone 
can spend $8/month, no up-front software cost or learning curve, and test 
the Internet.  I hope that this will allow many more people the opportunity 
to see what it is all about without having blow their budget on it.

STTS: How does the interface work?

Mr. Bunker: At present we are using Galacticomm and it runs off of a DOS 
computer.  We are going to roll out a pure UNIX system this month that will 
generate RIP screens.  I think that it will really knock people's socks off.  
Still, at present we have a system that will allow people to browse by area 
of interest, as well as search by topic, using standard Internet tools such 
as Veronica, etc., without having to know too much about them.

STTS: How much of the Internet can be accessed?

Mr. Bunker: We have everything but USENET right now.  So I would say 50-60% 
of the information can be seen through the setup that we have now.

STTS: How does the system work?

Mr. Bunker: Well right now we are running it off of a Galacticomm platform 
on a Novell network.  The server is TCP/IP compatible and that is how we 
bridge to the Internet.

STTS: I've read all about those thing, but since I haven't seen them, I 
forgot exactly what they were.  It's a bridge to the net, right, but at what 
level?

Mr. Bunker: Well, all the net really is, is a group of computers with wires 
running to each other.  The language that they speak is called TCP/IP.  If 
you have the wire an and the protocol then you are officially on the 
Internet.  At least that is what they tell me.  It seems to work fine for us 
so I guess that I believe them.

STTS: What does the USENET have?

Mr. Bunker: It is a collection of discussion groups that are transmitted 
along the wires (sort of like UPI or AP) to all the computers that wish to 
subscribe.  It provides a lot of bulk and interaction to the whole thing.

STTS: So those are the message boards and news boards?

Mr. Bunker: Yes, together they are collectively called USENET.

STTS: Are you planning to get the USENET, or not?

Mr. Bunker: Yes, it should be up and running in a week or so .  We didn't 
start with it because so many BBSes already have USENET via Planet Connect 
and friends. We wanted to start with the harder to find interactive features.

STTS: Is FIDO a USENET feature, or is it something else?

Mr. Bunker: FIDONET runs the same concept, but the phone lines are not 
connected 24 hours day.  It is received in a burst once or twice a day.  Same 
thing but different implementation.

STTS: What sorts of things are available via IOS on the Internet. ?

Mr. Bunker: Well we have all the gopher sites available which include a 
tremendous amount of information.  You can also call any computer that is 
hooked up (TELNET) this includes FedWorld.  You can also transfer files from 
anonymous sites which allows you access to the Terabytes of information.  
There are several search tools to allow you to search the entire space.  FTP 
is the hardest tool to use in my opinion.  You have a to know a few UNIX 
commands to make it behave.  I have several screens in the beginner area that 
spell out step by step how to retrieve a file using FTP.  It is not easy but 
I guess the people that designed were not too worried about that.

STTS: What are the other section of IOS, other than the Internet access?

Mr. Bunker: We have several other systems.  They include business, author's 
net, UFOs and patents.  Quite an eclectic sort.

STTS: And these systems are individual BBSes located in IOS itself?

Mr. Bunker: Yes, they are individual BBSes run by a pretty great group of 
people.

STTS: How do these BBSes operate?

Mr. Bunker: We have local access numbers across the country.  They signed up 
in order to get exposure across the country.  We tried to recreate the look 
and feel within the constraints of running different software to allow their 
long distance user to access them a little cheaper.

STTS: When was IOS first set up?

Mr. Bunker: We started recruiting in April of this year and implemented in 
June and added Internet last month.

STTS: Recruiting employees?

Mr. Bunker: No, BBSes to add content.

STTS: I thought IOS had been around for a longer.  In another form?

Mr. Bunker: Yes as a limited test BBS.  But it took a long time to negotiate 
the phone contract for the local access numbers.  That was the biggest hurdle 
to getting in the business.

STTS: Is that set up like the large systems, like Prodigy, Compuserve, and 
AOL?

Mr. Bunker: Yes but we have a smaller area of coverage, naturally.

STTS: How many lines do you have into the system?

Mr. Bunker: Counting the network lines from other cities, there are 
approximately 180 phone lines coming in at this time.

STTS: And how many users can access the system at one time?

Mr. Bunker: It depends on what they are all doing.  Since I placed the system 
on the Novell network I think it could handle 150 before starting to bog 
down, but it is rank speculation at this time.

STTS: I go crazy on systems so spend all my money on them.  If I could 
somehow regulate my time on - kick me off at a pre-arranged time.  I don't 
suppose this system does that?

Mr. Bunker: Yes actually we do.  For the Dallas user the $8 get them 2 hours 
a day.  The system automatically removes them at the end of the time so they 
don't have to worry about running up a bill.

STTS: Is there any way someone who wanted more time could get it?

Mr. Bunker: Yes $16 will get you 4 hours a day, etc.

STTS: What kind of technical support do you give?

Mr. Bunker: Well, we are available from 8am to 6pm to field questions in 
person by calling (214) 979-9072 and on-line most of the evening.  Then the 
user can send us e-mail asking any question.  So far there haven't been that 
many questions, precisely because people are using software that they know 
and love.

STTS: So can any communication software access IOS?

Mr. Bunker: Well if it has text, ANSI, or RIP interface then they can reach 
us and use the Internet.

STTS: At what speeds (BPS) does IOS run?

Mr. Bunker: Our Dallas numbers are 14.4.  The nation-wide numbers are 
typically 9600, but we also have a few dreaded 2400 out there in some cities.

STTS: Does IOS have Internet E-mail?

Mr. Bunker: Yes and no.  Yes we have it on our UNIX machine, but we are 
waiting on some cable in order to bridge it over to the system so all our 
users can have it.  I hope to have it on-line by Monday.

STTS: Will there be a menu driven editor for the Email, or will it be 
operated by the UNIX commands?

Mr. Bunker: I think that it will be sent straight from the standard Email 
area. The system will know based on the address.

STTS: About the USENET, are you going to have all groups on it, or are you 
going to leave out certain things, like the really weird ALT groups?

Mr. Bunker: Probably leave out a few, due to personal tastes of my employers.  
We are currently developing a total graphic front end to map the newsgroups 
according to topic.  It will run straight off of the UNIX system.  I think 
the look will blow people away, but here again, it is not working today.  So 
we will just have to wait and see when we can bring it on-line.

STTS: When is it projected to come on-line?

Mr. Bunker: The developer has it up and running on a 486 using just using 
UNIX, but in order to make it technically feasible it has to be moved to our 
UNIX system.  He is doing that now, but there is no way to predict all the 
difficulties until he tries to run it.  I think in 3 weeks we will have it 
ready for people to start calling.

STTS: What sorts of things will be left out of the USENET?  Is there a sort 
of 'family values' philosophy behind it, or something else?

Mr. Bunker: Well, basically since the family has such a high profile, we 
aren't going to   carry anything that would get our faces on 'Hardcopy' and 
such for polluting young minds.  I personally don't see too much wrong with a 
lot of it, but the legal issues are real and we would rather stay away from 
the controversy.

STTS: There are mild forms of adult things, though.  Will there be some sort 
of 'age screen' to keep the children out of areas that aren't too bad, but 
could receive an 'R' rating?

Mr. Bunker: I would like to do it that way.  It will take more time to set 
up but I think it will be worth it.  There are many people who don't want 
their children exposed and I don't blame them.  Yet you want to appeal to 
the broad market so we will have differentiate.

STTS: Is IRC available on IOS?

Mr. Bunker: Not yet, but it will be on the UNIX system.  I think it is one of 
the coolest things out there.

STTS: What sorts of things are available on IRC?

Mr. Bunker: IRC is a global chat.  So it is no different than chat here, just 
you have hundreds of people on-line all the time so it is pretty cool.

STTS: Is there any way to gain emergency extra time other than paying for 
another 'level' that month?

Mr. Bunker: Yes you could sign up for the non-local account.  It is $8/month 
for 2 hours then every hour after that is $3.50/hour with no limit.

STTS: Where does IOS fit into the over-all scheme of Internet servers?

Mr. Bunker: We think that our niche will be providing a road map for people 
to travel the Internet.

STTS: For that you need explorers.  Is that what you do?

Mr. Bunker: Yes I spend a lot of my time exploring but we will need to find 
others to help as we go along.  John, our UNIX man, has mapped 4,000 
newsgroups, but there  is so much more that it will take a team to do it all.

STTS: Is IOS a kind of travel agent, providing people with maps and booking 
on flights and what not?  Is that an accurate description?

Mr. Bunker: Yes, although my analogy is that of a TV company.  Anyone can set 
up an Internet connection.  It is creating interesting programming that will 
make the whole thing entertaining and useful for the average person.  So as 
long as people like our programming they will tune into our channel.  The 
resources are the same for every provider, just the slant on their interface 
and destinations.

STTS: So what is your favorite part of IOS - what do you use on it?

Mr. Bunker: I love cruising gophers, but I think that MUD are the king.  This 
weekend I am going to put together a list of 40 MUDs and make them available 
from the top Internet menu.  I think people will love them.

STTS: Is there anything else about IOS that I have failed to ask about?

Mr. Bunker: No that about covers it.  It is simple yet extremely complex.  It 
just takes time to build it up, which we are doing every day.  I added a 
non-profit resource area in my Browsing section today.  Tomorrow it is MUDs.  
The next - who knows?

STTS: So IOS will be growing on and on in an attempt to deliver the Internet?

Mr. Bunker: Yes.  The day our programming stops people will get tired and 
tune in somewhere else.

STTS: Well, Thank you for letting me interview you in your valuable time.

For more information contact IOS at:

(214) 979-9072, for voice, or

(214) 922-8167, for modem.

